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Horse Carriages Off The Street


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#21 Patches

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 05:18 PM

Morenita, what you say is true. But war is won through fighting many battles over periods of months or even years. There are many casualties in battle, but that is how it goes. If we all threw up our hands and went "There is no point in fighting the battle because we are not going to win the war" is a bit short-sighted, don't you think?
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#22 cvchief

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 05:27 PM

Well, I think Morenita was just saying getting them off the street was only one battle, not that it shouldn't be fought. She makes a good point that you sometimes solve one problem and create another. Unintended consequences are a real pain....
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#23 Coz2wonder

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 05:33 PM

Lets be happy for at least one victory...the big concern is what happens AFTER.

Some possibilities as I see it as to what might happen to the horses.

1. The owners of the horses win their appeal, and the horses are back on the streets

2. The owners of the horses loose their appeal, and the horses are in limbo
1. The horses are sold
2. The horses are given away
3. The horses are abandon

I can only hope that the local agencies on the island can step forward, and UP to the the changles coming next.
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#24 Coz2wonder

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 06:09 PM

YIKES...I am so sorry, I think I deleted posts...I am new at the controls.

I am truly sorry.

Coz2wonder.
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#25 morenita

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 06:30 PM

Yes, mine was deleted. No te preocupes. Not to worry.

"war is won through fighting many battles over periods of months or even years".

I totally agree. There can be many battles and it can take time. In this case it has been going on for many years.

"There is no point in fighting the battle because we are not going to win the war"

When did I ever imply this?

You are right. If that is what I had meant. Then I do think it would have been "a bit short-sighted"

But that is not what I was attempting to say. If that is what I implied then I appologize. Sorry if my english is not perfect. I am still learning.

What I said was: "these can be complicated matters. Just because you won the battle does not mean you won the war". I was agreeing with Coz2 wonder that "one problem was solved with the horses off the streets. Now what to do with these horses without creating another form of abuse to them".

Maybe my example was not a very good one, but what I was tyring to say is that when you fix one problem you can create a new one. If you close one door you may open one or more new ones. But Chief said it much better than I could "you sometimes solve one problem and create another. Unintended consequences are a real pain."

Sometimes you need to retreat and attack from a diffferent direction, if you want to continue with this analogy. But I was never suggesting surrender.

It might require a new or different strategy. A different battle plan.

I was certainly not suggesting we all throw up our hands. So sorry if you thought that.

You may need to go back and approach it from a different angle.

You are right Chief. One down, on to the next.

Coz2wonder. Very well said once again! "Lets be happy for at least one victory...the big concern is what happens AFTER."

And you so accurately described what may happen next. So now its on to fight the next battle.
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#26 Patches

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 07:40 PM

Morenita - I have to congratulate you because I would never have guessed that your language was not English - you write very well and eloquently. Thanks for clarifying your side. So now after all that, all I want to know is how do we help out with the future of these horses? Does anyone know? I am newish to the island but would really like to help these animals in some way. If anybody knows who we can get more information from, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks much!!
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#27 morenita

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 09:43 PM

Thanks Patches. But if you only knew how many times I have to keep going back and editing. All I can say is thank God for the edit option. Mil gracias.
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#28 Freezin' Canuck

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 02:56 AM

Definitely something to think about Coz2wonder. "Out of sight"; now "out of mind", I suppose. One problem solved; yet another created. Collateral damage to the horses? I wonder what the abolitionists' take was about freeing slaves? As I'm pondering that, grateful the power has just come been restored here after a ferocious winter storm. Grateful to the hydro crews who worked round the clock to get us back on the grid. All by way of saying, Cozumel sounds pretty good right now...horse and carriages notwithstanding.
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#29 Freezin' Canuck

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 03:03 AM

When I posted the previous, I couldn't see all of the other fine posts on the subject (just Coz2wonder's were showing-the others weren't up on my screen-collateral damage from our storm?) so just ignore my comments with my apologies.
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#30 morenita

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 11:20 AM

No tenemos nada a disculpar. No need to appologize. I appreciated your comments. It never hurts to hear something restated in a different way. I liked the "Out of sight now out of mind" comment. Personally I really like the slavery analogy. Well done! While emancipation freed the slaves by official proclamation. Blacks were still forced into labor and did not have the freedoms enjoyed by whites due to Jim Crow laws and segregation. Cozumel was to be sold to the United States. President Lincoln had planned to purchase it to relocate the freed slaves. But civil (caste) war in Mexico (Yucatan)prevented it. I always learn so much studying this part of American history. Mexico has our own dark parts of history. Lessons learned from the past can be applied to the present.

Keep warm y que Dios les bendiga.
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#31 Coz_Aholic

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 01:29 PM

How strange that this is what popped up when I got quote for you Coz_Aholic??

Anyways, they are definitely stinky, and I do not want to be around stinky animals within the city limits – that’s one reason why I live in the city! Horses have a history of spooking for stupid reasons, and that to me constitutes a stupid animal. I live in Texas so we’ve been around quite a few horses and I have seen more than my fair share of horse freakouts – I don’t like being around them.

Notice, I never said ugly – they’re definitely pretty. I just don’t think man belongs on top of them or riding in a carriage behind them.

MC

PS – exception – Appaloosas are ugly... lol



Mark, clarify please, what do you mean "this is what popped up" I quoted someone else who made the statement, so your point is?
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#32 Freezin' Canuck

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 06:07 AM

No tenemos nada a disculpar. No need to appologize. I appreciated your comments. It never hurts to hear something restated in a different way. I liked the "Out of sight now out of mind" comment. Personally I really like the slavery analogy. Well done! While emancipation freed the slaves by official proclamation. BNlacks were still forced into labor and did not have the freedoms enjoyed by whites due to Jim Crow laws and segregation. Cozumel was to be sold to the United States. President Lincoln had planned to purchase it to relocate the freed slaves. But civil war here in Mexico prevented it. I always learn so much studying this part of American history. Mexico has our own dark parts of history. Lessons learned from the past can be applied to the present.

Keep warm y que Dios les bendiga.

Thank you for that fascinating information, Morenita. As a history buff, I have much to learn. A second Liberia in Cozumel but for civil war? Amazing! Another example of the effect of history on our present and future. There is more to Cozumel than Mayan ruins, a warm climate and nice people.
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#33 MarkC

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:06 AM

Mark, clarify please, what do you mean "this is what popped up" I quoted someone else who made the statement, so your point is?


WOW - that is so wierd! I did not see the part where you quoted when I replied to you until I hit quote... Call is a computer screw up I guess - that was so strange...
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#34 morenita

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 12:42 PM

"There is more to Cozumel than Mayan ruins, a warm climate and nice people"

Some may have been destroyed when the United States built their airport here for the World War II, and others when the town of San Miguel was settled.

P.S. I love that breed of horses I saw in a beer commercial in EE.UU. Don't know the name but they sure are beautiful.
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#35 cvchief

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 02:40 PM

The Budweiser Clydesdales? They are some big, pampered horses. We had them in July last year.
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#36 morenita

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 02:45 PM

That's the ones. I couldn't remember the name. Those are some beautiful horses. I just love them.
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#37 MarkC

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 05:27 PM

We had them in July last year.


For dinner? :D
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#38 cvchief

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 07:03 PM

For dinner? :D


That would take a lotta taters for sides.....:blink:

By the by, Mark I took a nice shot at you in the homeopathic thread and you let it go. :o
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#39 CZMDM

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 07:25 AM

Actually the military did not destroy ruins as has been mentioned here. That is a popular myth for some reason. There were never any major ruins here. The closest major archeological site to the water is Tuluum. Read the book "Incidents of Travel in the Yucatan" by John L. Stephens, Pub. 1843. Stephens and associates were the discoverers of all major Mayan sites. The Maya were too smart to build near the water because of hurricane issues. The book specifically mentions the explorers surpise at the lack of Mayan sites, of any value, on the island. Although it is a fairly dry read, the story is fascinating. The book has 147 engravings. It includes an engraving of Cozumel from 1840. It is amazing. Stephens was the model for Steven Spielbergs "Indiana Jones" character.
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#40 MarkC

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 09:01 AM

That would take a lotta taters for sides.....:blink:

By the by, Mark I took a nice shot at you in the homeopathic thread and you let it go. :o


maybe I missed it - i'll go look

LOL!
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